Happier Grey with Stella Scott

Helen: Hello and thanks for joining me, Helen Johnson, for the Happier Grey podcast. I'm pro-ageing and love my grey hair, but I know it can be quite intimidating to take the plunge, so each week I'll be chatting to other women who've chosen to embrace the grey in the hope of inspiring and supporting you, whether you already have silver hair, in the process of going grey, or just considering ditching the dye.

Today I'm joined by Stella Scott. She's a coach, gestalt therapist, astrologer, and opera singer who lives in Malmo. She recently launched her own app, Cosmic Strategies, where she inspires women leaders to transform their self-image, guiding them to become queens of their own lives through a unique blend of holistic practices.

Hello Stella, how are you?

Stella: Hello. I'm fine. How are you?

Helen: I'm good. It's actually a sunny day here in the North East of England, which is rare. Don't know what it's like with you?

Stella: It's sunny. It's wonderful. It's warm. We're happy because this is Scandinavia. It won't last for long. So when it's here, it's like, Oh, wow.

Helen: Yes, you have to take your chances when you get them.

Stella: Right.

Helen: Okay. So, I'm going to start by asking you, about when you found your first grey hair. Can you remember when that was?

Stella: That was sometime in my thirties. I can't say if it was my early or late thirties, but, I know it was after some certain events in my life. 

Helen: And how did you feel about it when you first found it? 

Stella: I thought it was like a badge of honour. Like, whoa, I've reached like a kind of maturity, you know, I have grey hair. The thought of pulling it out did not occur to me, and also I have a lot of hair, so it didn't really show, I don't know even how I found it amongst this mess of curls. 

But I did really feel like it was a kind of sign of maturity. I had past 30. I had gone through certain things in life and I had my first grey hair. It was good.

Helen: so, did you think about dyeing it or have you always just left it? 

Stella: I did henna dyeing, when I was younger. My hair is not very, apt to absorbing other colours. And, I never really thought of dyeing it, or trying to have other colours. I can look at people with, they have dark hair, and then they had to bleach it, and then it turns red, or pink, and if it looks good, it's no problem. But I wouldn't do that, because I would not like to bleach my hair, I think that's really harmful, and it's also a lot of chemicals that I don't need.

So, I used the henna for a while to get some kind of, yeah, it was modern. It was like, I don't know, I was in my early 20s, late teens, early 20s. And then I just left it. 

But what happened later on is that I decided to just give it a try to dye it black. Had nothing to do with my grey hair strand, I just wanted to dye like pitch black and see what happened.

So, I did that. And that was so interesting because I got a lot of comments. Even there was like a stranger on the subway that you have such fantastic hair. And I was like, this hasn't happened before. So, I continued to dye it black, but it had nothing to do with my grey hair or like it wasn't grey.

It was just very dark brown. And I wanted like, pull it down one notch, so to speak.

Helen: Okay, so how long did you keep dyeing it for then?

Stella: I did that for a long time. Let me see, it was in 2019 or something I cut my hair really, really short because I had to like get rid of old energies They were hanging in my hair and I felt I had to cut it. I don't enjoy having really short hair, like pixie cuts, it's not, for me. But I really needed to cut, so I cut it all. 

No, let's go back, because I started to stop dyeing the front of my hair, because I could see that it was like getting more and more grey, white, whatever. And I liked that. So, I decided to leave that alone. So, when I dyed the rest of it, I kept this part in the front on the right side, because that was getting whiter and whiter. And then I expanded that to let it become like bigger, but I kept the other black because I liked the contrast. And what I then saw, when I grew older was that my, very dark hair, was becoming blah. The nuance was not as sharp, and so preppy. I continued to dye it black. 

But when I cut the pixie cut, I saw that it had a lot of grey and I thought, oh, I just really grow out. But The colour was not flattering. 

Helen: So, you had the pixie cut and you weren't seeing as much contrast. So did you then decide to just leave it and let it grow out?

Stella: No, I decided that I would keep like the upper part and the white part. That was taking up a lot of space, which was good. But I let, the hair grow out while I was dyeing it like underneath, so to speak. I don't know if this makes sense. Um, but then I got to a point when I really felt like it's pretty white now.

Also, one point I dyed it myself. I never went to the hairdresser. So, it wasn't as costly for me. And because I was growing out some of it, it didn't make any big difference how it looked. 

I could see it, but it was not really a big, big thing of I had to dye it. It's growing out and I get, you know, this outgrowth that looks ugly. I never thought about that. 

So, I went to my hairdresser and said, cut it, because then I could have like a bob, which I usually have. I said, just cut away coloured parts, because all dyes turn yellow when you don't dye them. It doesn't matter what colour it is from the beginning. Perhaps not blues, but if you have like brown or black, they become yellowish.

 So, I said, just take away that yellowish part, all of it, because I'm done. And that was, I don't know, a couple of years ago. I'm 65. So, I dyed it for, about 30 years. To get back to your initial question.

Helen: But you kind of dyed it for drama.

Stella Yes.

 Helen: Rather than because you were concerned about the greyness.

Stella: The greyness had no, no part of it whatsoever.

Helen: Well, it kind of became a feature of it, didn't it really, if you were leaving the stripe in the front.

Stella: Yes, and it felt natural because I also felt that I am getting older and it's natural. And I saw when I, decided to get that part growing and more visible, I saw an image of myself where I was interviewed in the magazine of some sort. And when I saw those images, I felt like my hair and my skin tone, it doesn't look natural anymore.

Helen: Uh huh.

Stella: And that was like, no, has to go. So that's when I started to grow it out. And also, because it was in the front of my face, it looked, much better, when the grey was coming out. Because I looked like a woman who tried to look younger. 

Helen: So, just for context, cause obviously the listeners can't see you, you have curly hair and it's shoulder length-ish now.

Yes. Would you say?

Stella: Yes, yes it is. And it's quite curly. So, it really depends on the weather and the humidity and when I washed it. It can be longer and shorter. And that it has happened that I just washed my hair and then people ask me if I've cut it because it shrinks up so much. So, it's very versatile, that way.

Helen: And how do you feel about your hair now you've let it all go grey?

Stella: Oh, I love it. I absolutely love it. And I get so many compliments, strangers on the street. Especially when the sun is shining, because I get like a silver halo around and it's amazing. I'm watching it myself, it's like, whoa. I made a couple of posts, one on LinkedIn and one on Facebook where I said, I'm so in love with my hair, because of this silver shine.

Yeah, I find it beautiful.

Helen: Cool. I love that you love it. Okay, can I ask you a question then? I'm fascinated about the attitude to going grey in Sweden, and whether it's the same as it is in the UK, because obviously in the UK it's pretty normal to dye your hair to cover the greys?

Stella: Yeah, right. I have listened to several of your podcasts and your guests, and I have understood that it's a big thing, and that it's difficult. I mean, emotionally to go grey for Brits. And that's not the case here. Sure, women dye their hair, but going grey is not a big thing. And that kind of comments or compliments I've never had here since I let it turn all grey.

It's not a thing. I would say women of my age, it's like 50 50 that are dyeing it. One of my neighbours, she's about 20 years younger than I, but she started to go grey quite early, and she said that when I started to go grey, I felt like I was not ready.

Helen: Yeah.

Stella: But now she's 45 and she is still dyeing her hair, but not as dark. She said, I'm like emotionally getting into it. And she's one of the few women that I have met that has like a real issue with her hair being grey.

Helen: That is interesting because that is, I think, quite different here. I think there is quite a lot of pressure on women to try to look younger

Stella: I have been so surprised listening to your guests that that is really a thing that there is a pressure and, that people have opinions. You want to go grey or you want to dye your hair. You want it to be pink. You want it to be black. You want to have braids. I mean, who am I to care, really?

Helen: Okay, I think that's a much healthier attitude in my mind that the Swedes have than we have. But anyway, I was just going to ask you a question about, ageing generally and how you feel about ageing. And where you're at in the ageing process.

Stella: Well, as I said, I felt like I wanted my hair to go with my body. I'm born with a disability. So, I have, ever since I was a child, I have been very aware of my body and what it can do and cannot do. And when I was about 15, I realized that I really have to take care of my body to have good feet. I'm born with club feet.

So, my feet and my legs will be as strong as possible when I grow old. So, I have been very aware of my body and how to take care of it since I was in my teenage. So, the process of ageing, it has been fairly easy, because I have always been aware that ageing is a part of life.

 t's a privilege in many ways, and there are certain things that are challenging, of course. My ageing process is, I don't look my age at all. People constantly say what?

But I also don't feel that. I have taken in a lot of food supplements and I have been fasting and I have done all this thing. I've been meditating since I was 12. I started taking food supplements already as a child because my grandparents would give me food supplements. So, I have always been very aware of what the body needs and what's necessary.

I have always been exercising. I was a professional dancer. So, this part of ageing is like, how do I age, the term used is like gracefully, but it's like, how do I age in a way that is as healthy and good as possible for me? 

So, when people say you don't look your age, it's like, yes, I do. This is my age. This is my way of looking at 65.

And also, I have to put this one in here, that this whole thing of age is just a number, it freaks me out. I'm not going to swear, but that was close. No. Because age is not just a number. For me when you say age is just a number, that is insulting, to your life experience, to what you have with you, what you've gone through.

And it's saying that being young, number wise is better than being older. And I've been interviewed about this too, this thing of what it is. And, and every time I see it, it's like, but you're insulting yourself. It is not just a number. It’s so much more. And I'm very happy. I'm 65.

Helen: Yeah. You're proud of it rather than trying to hide from it, 

Stella: Yeah. And trying to make excuses to say that it doesn't matter. And it's not valid. And, of course it is. I have much more experience than someone who's 20 or 35. That doesn't mean that they don't have a good deal of things that I can learn from them, but

Helen: Uh huh.

Stella: to saying that those years that I had been around. That exceed them are not valid, that it's just a number, 

Helen: Okay. A couple of other things I'm just curious about in terms of differences between the countries. In the UK, one of the things about when you have grey hair is traditionally when you have grey hair, you have it cut short. Probably that's changing a little bit now, but I'm just wondering whether that's the same, a similar thing in Sweden or not?

Stella: yeah, I think a lot of women have been cutting it short. I think that is changing a little too. I usually have a bob. I am letting it grow out. My hair doesn't get very long, but I want to see how this grey mass is looking on me when it grows out as far as it can, because there is such a lot of it. 

There was a woman here in Malmo, when I moved here about 20 years ago and she was, I wouldn't think the age I had now, and she had long grey hair down to her hips. And that's so beautiful. Dark, like my own, not as curly, but, but wavy. That's unusual to have that long hair, but I would say that women have not so much pixie, as much pixie.

It has been, I think it's been a bit more before. It's a good question because I have not been really observant of that. But my friends, I mean, in my age range, none of them has a pixie as far as I can remember. Yeah, one, that is because she has such thin hair and she said, I can't have long hair. It doesn't look good to me. I never had long hair. 

Helen: Okay. Then I guess the other question is really around style as well and the way that people dress. Does that change as people get older or is there less of that  in Sweden as well?

Stella: It might change a little, but not that much. Swedes are fairly known for having style or being stylish and looking well put together. And that continues. We don't do the US version of running around in hoodies 

Helen: Yeah.

Stella: Dumbing yourself down clothes wise if I would put it that way. So, I think older women there's a slight shift, but not that much. I think some women are aware of like arms. They wouldn't wear short sleeves like I do but I actually, I'm not sure I was so truthful there. After this interview, I'll actually not go out and look.

Helen: I think it probably says it's not something that's noticeable.

Stella: Yes, I was just going to go in that direction. It's like, because I'm not noticing it and I'm very observant. That's probably not a big thing. They don't look like teenagers, but yeah, they look like women.

Helen: Probably didn't wear miniskirts as much in the first place. So,

Stella: No, exactly. 

Helen: Not the really tight things. When I think of the style of the Scandinavians, it's fitted, but it's looser than a lot of the sort of spray on skin type things that maybe the teenagers here do. 

Stella: This T-shirt or whatever we should call this that I'm wearing, this it's pretty tight, but not the skirt and I'm wearing it. That's not it. For me it's really important that it's comfortable, comfy is like number one. It has to be comfortable and look good at the same time at all times. It's really a question of how do I dress to feel my best? And if something is uncomfortable, I don't feel my best. I cannot perform my best. I cannot be present with other people. Because I would be so occupied with, it's too tight here or I can't breathe or something like that. So, I think that is probably also important, for Swedes that it's like fairly comfortable.

Helen: I do actually have some Swedish clothes and, they definitely fit that pattern. Okay. So, I'm going to ask you one last question. If somebody came to you and said, I'm thinking about going grey, what advice would you give to them?

Stella: Yes, do it. And, the thing with today is that you can always change your mind. You can decide to go grey, and then you can decide to go pink. Shave it off. I mean, there's just so many options, but I would absolutely say yes. 

I have a friend that is in my age and she has been dyeing her hair. We just met the other day and she said, no, I've decided to like let it go. And it's like, and it's, it's not a big decision. And I said, yeah, good for you. And that was it. we were talking about other things. I said, do it, if it really feels like something that is right for you and if you have been dying your hair to satisfy other people and out of fear of judgment, do it, be brave.

Helen: Yeah. I think the thing that most people have said when I've talked to them, is that the fear of the reaction of other people it is very different to what they've actually had. So maybe before they decided to grow it out, they thought people would judge them badly. But in general, people have had positive reactions and compliments, and, it's not been nearly as big a deal as they made it out to be in their head before they started.

Stella: Perhaps you will even inspire someone

Helen: Mm

Stella: to do the same thing. Perhaps you will be a real role model and see yourself as a role model. I actually do. I do see myself as a role model, when it comes to the way I age and my attitude towards ageing and, also my hair.

Helen: hmm.

Stella: To encourage anyone. And, when I say role model, I don't only mean role models for women my age.

I mean, role model for my neighbour, who's 20 years younger and for her kids I think the oldest one is 12.

Helen: Mm hmm.

Stella: So, I'm a grandmother age for them. And in that way, I am a role model because my grandmother is still a role model for me. 

Helen: Okay. Well, I am going to leave it there. Thank you so much for joining me. It's been lovely chatting to you.

Stella: Thank you! I'm so happy that you invited me.

Helen: Thanks so much for joining me for this week's show. I hope you've enjoyed it as much as I have. I'll be back again next week, but in the meantime, you can follow me on Instagram at happier. grey. Have a great week.