Helen: Hello, and thanks for joining me, Helen Johnson for the Happier Grey Podcast. I'm pro-ageing and love my grey hair, but I know it can be quite intimidating to take the plunge. So, each week I'll be chatting to other women who've chosen to embrace the grey in the hope of inspiring and supporting you, whether you already have silver hair, in the process of going grey or just considering ditching the dye.

Today I'm joined by Lori Alpino Holloway, a 60-year-old, former New Yorker, who lives in the state of Colorado. She started colouring her hair at the age of 16 and made the life altering decision to stop doing so four years ago. 

Hello, Lori. How are you?

Lori:I am doing great. How are you?

Helen: I'm also doing great. 

So, my first thing I was gonna ask you is, you started colouring your hair when you were 16. Was that because you were starting to see white hairs coming through? Or you were you just having a bit of fun?

Lori: I was just having a bit of fun. My father owned a beauty salon. So, I had access to all of these wonderful, services. And I started colouring it for fun, just doing highlights and things like that. And then when I was about 19, I noticed my first grey.

Helen: And how did you feel about that when you saw it?

Lori: I didn't like it. I didn't like it at all, so I promptly covered it up with hair dye, and did so for, nearly the next 40 years.

Helen: What colour was your hair before you started dyeing it?

Lori: It was very, very dark brown.

Helen: So, the white obviously showed up?

Lori: It was very noticeable. And later on, when I got married, my husband would lovingly refer to it as my skunk stripe.

Helen: Very supportive then?

Lori: Yeah. But I didn't like it. And as a matter of fact, my father would beg me, he said, you know what, it would look so striking if you would just leave it alone and not colour it.

And I told him, never I will dye my hair until my dying day. So, I obviously changed my mind on that.

Helen: The stripe you had, was it just at the front, to start with?

Lori: To start. And then, it just kind of took over. I think if I would have not dyed my hair, I probably would have been pretty close to all white by 30. Definitely.

Helen: Okay. And were you always dyeing at the dark colour?

Lori: I was. Always putting the dark, dark brown. Sometimes I would go a little lighter to change it up, but mostly dark brown.

Helen: How often were you having to dye it?

Lori: My hair grows very quickly. So, when I got it done professionally, it would be, 'cause I moved out of New York and then I had to go find a salon and actually pay to get my hair done. And oh, my goodness, it was so expensive. I would get it done professionally about every six weeks.

But I had to touch it up on my own at home, nearly every two weeks, to hide the growth. Just do my part and around my face to buy some time until I could get into the salon again.

Helen: Were you doing that with one of the touch-up pens, or were you actually dyeing that strip?

Lori: Most of the time I would dye it. And then, if I had to go out somewhere, and I saw a little bit that was showing maybe an eighth of an inch or something like that, I would use the touch-up pen or a crayon. Something like a crayon. 

Helen: Yeah.

Lori: To colour it in.

Helen: Obviously, you've said you were going to be a diehard, I'll colour it until I die person. What happened to change that?

Lori: You know what, it's interesting because I think I just really had had enough. There was nothing monumental that happened in my life. Nobody said anything to me. Or said that dies are unhealthy, or anything like that. 

I just got tired of it. Every time I went to the salon, it was three hours of my life. And a lot of money that I had to fork over. And it was exhausting. I didn't like dealing with the mess anymore. Just the hassle of everything associated with it.

And so, I decided to give it a try in 2022, and I went forward with full conviction. I was ready to do it. I was ready to just get that time back in my life. I didn't wanna spend that time and that money anymore.

Helen: Had you been thinking about it for a while?

Lori: I was toying with the idea. As a matter of fact, during Lockdown, I seriously considered it. But I didn't feel ready. I saw the growth coming in, the white hairs showing more than ever, and I didn't colour it at home. I just kind of was watching it grow, and I thought about it. But I wasn't ready. 

And I always said to myself, okay, maybe when I retire from teaching. Because I worked in a high school, and I was worried about how the kids would react to seeing my hair go through that process. I thought that maybe some of them would be unkind. So, I thought about it, but I wasn't ready. And then, I just so regretted going back to colouring after that point. 

Then, when school started, my last year of work, as a matter of fact. That August before school started, something just clicked in me and I said, I'm going to do it. And I don't care if the kids say whatever it is that they may say, about my hair and how silly it looks. I'm just going to do it. And I did. 

And they were so overwhelmingly supportive. It was wonderful. I was just kicking myself from not doing it earlier. I don't know what I was afraid of. I don't know. I guess I just had to muster up the courage because it's a big step. It was a big step for me to take, to embrace that part of myself.

Helen: The actual grow-out itself, how did you do it? Did you just leave it?

Lori: I bit the bullet and I let it go. And I didn't do anything to try to blend it in, and I know a lot of people do that.

Having such long hair, I knew that if I wanted to go that route, it would've been very involved, and very damaging for my hair. And I made the decision that if I was going to do this, I wanted the new growth, to be as healthy as possible. And I wanted my current length to be as healthy as possible.

I knew if I tried to bleach it out and blend it, I would maybe do damage to my hair, and have to cut it off. And since my hair is my security blanket. I wasn't willing to take that chance, so I just let it roll. And I had that skunk stripe grow larger, and larger, and larger, as it inched down my head. And that was it. I just let it rip.

Helen: That's interesting. A lot of people I've spoken to say the first few inches are difficult, because they feel judged by people all thinking maybe they've just been lazy, and they haven't got round to getting hair appointment. Did you have any of that?

Lori: I had people come up and ask me, what are you doing? What's going on? Are you doing something different with your hair? And, I'm talking about people who knew me, and people who didn't know me. Because people all over town would approach me and ask me. 

And I thought that was so interesting, because we don't do that with fellow humans in any other capacity, pretty much. We don't walk up to people and ask them what is going on you know, it's like, you don't even know me. But I think, a lot of women in particular, it was mostly women who came up to me, wanted clarification.

And then a lot of them shared that they were thinking about doing it, but they weren't ready to go grey. And they just wanted to know, is that in fact what you are doing? And oh, my goodness, how brave you are. What a brave soul you are, to march into this unknown territory. So it was, yeah, it was interesting. 

People didn't say like, oh, did you forget you know, to colour your hair. More so, it was like, hey, what are you doing there? Are you going grey? It's almost as if they knew, what I was doing, but they just wanted clarification.

Helen: Did you at any point in the grow-out have doubts, and get tempted to dye again?

Lori: When I made the announcement to my hairdresser. That salon I had been going to for several years, and they knew how much I cared about my hair, and how I always wanted it to look pretty.  When I made that announcement, the whole salon was a buzz.

And they all said to me, you're not gonna be able to do it. She's not gonna be able to do it. When it gets to be about four inches, we’re going to have to talk you down from the ledge, because I mean like, you are gonna wanna totally give up. You're not going to be able to do it. When it gets to that point, it's going to be really difficult for you to look at and see, knowing how you are with your hair. 

And I said, well I think I'm ready for it. And the more they've told me that I couldn't do it, that I wouldn't be able to ride out the storm, the more defiant. Like it just empowered me. And I said to myself, I'm going to show them that I can do this, and I'm not going to cave. 

It just fuelled me more in my decision. It was something that I wanted to do. But when I heard them speak that way. It just kind of empowered me a little bit more, like I'm gonna show them. And I did. I think they were taking bets as a matter of fact.

Helen: Your hair is very long.

Lori: It is. It's always been long.

Helen: Did you have any of the length cut off it during the grow-out, or did you just keep it the same length?

Lori: I had a couple of haircuts where I brought the length up to maybe just a couple of inches below my shoulder. That was as short as I was willing to go. Right now, I'm in the process of growing it a little bit longer, because I still have some residual dye. It's very faded. So, I wanted to grow it a little bit longer, before I cut those final couple of inches off, where it's still a little bit faded.

Helen: Your hair is very white. What do you do to keep it in good condition?

Lori: I have to admit that it is a little bit of a struggle. And I think that is because I live in a semi-arid desert, we have over 300 days a year of sunshine. I know that that has an impact on my hair. 

So, I'm always looking for the perfect product, the perfect shampoo that will maybe counteract some of the yellowing that I see. Sometimes people tell me that they can't see it, but I can see it. I find that it's sometimes, tricky to find the right product that's going to remove the yellow, without making your hair have a purple cast to it, bluish cast to it.

That part has been a little bit of a challenge for me. I try to always wear a hat, when I go outside, to protect my hair from the sun. And I try to not use a lot of heat when I style my hair. Most of the time I'll let it air dry, and just let it be. 

But it is a little challenge for me with regard to that yellowing. So, I think it's something that people in sunny climates have to be aware of.

Helen: Have you found any products that you would actually recommend to people?

Lori: There is something put out by L'Oreal, that is a toning product, that doesn't have any ammonia and it doesn't have any, peroxide in it. I use that on occasion, and I am pleased with the job that it does. 

But I've also tried a lot of shampoos and conditioners, and I have yet to find the perfect one. But I do like that L’Oreal product that is a toner.

Helen: How do you find the condition of your hair now, compared to when you dyed it?

Lori: It is so much more shiny, and healthy. And I don't have many split ends at all. I'm quite pleased with the overall health of my hair. I'm happy with it.

Helen: I'm guessing you're going to the salon a lot less regularly than you used to then?

Lori: I think the last time I went for, anything was, we are in the month of May right now, it had to be November or October of last year. So, I have to apologize to my former stylist, because she's not making that money. I do go on occasion to get trims and things like that, but really maybe every six or seven months, just to clean up the ends.

It's so much easier. I have more time. Less worry. I don't have to look, oh my goodness Is this showing. You know, is the grey showing? Is it obvious? Do I have to go buy more hair dyed? Do I have to do this and ask my husband to do the back, because I can't see the back.

Which he was not a fan of doing. He's, I don't know what I'm doing. I'm like, just paint. It's just painting. And so, you know, it's just so much easier. And then when you wash off the hair dye, it makes a big mess in the bathroom and you have to clean all of the tiles, and all of this business. 

So, I'm just very happy with my life, now that I've taken this step, with regard to my hair.

Helen: How did your friends and family react when you told them you were gonna go grey?

Lori: It was interesting. My husband is a fan of very dark hair. And when I told him that I was going to do this and I said, I think it will look okay, he was hesitant. And he said, well, okay, yeah. But I could tell by the tone of his voice that he was a little disappointed that it was giving up the darker colour.

I had some cousins tell me, we've all voted, and we want you to stay with brown hair. I didn't know that that was an option, for you. But, other than that. People just were like, okay, you know, fine. You think you're going to be able to do it? And I said, yeah, I think I can. I think I'm going to, be able to be patient, and let it all grow out. And they were supportive. 

But I'll have to tell you honestly, the most support that I received, was from women in the street. People in markets, people in the hardware store, coming up to me and asking me, you know, what are you doing? Are you going grey? 

I've been thinking about it, but I don't know if I could take that step. I don't know if I am read. I don't know if I'm brave enough to go out in public, with my hair looking all askew. And I said to them. You can do it. When you're ready, if you feel comfortable with it, just do it. You'll know when the time is right. You'll know when the time is right.

I had a lot of women say to me, well, if my hair was your colour, I think it's going to look mousey. And I tell them all the same thing. Mother Nature knows what she's doing. She gives us the colour that is right for us. And you just have to trust her.

Because I was so hesitant in the beginning, because I have very olive tone skin, and when I saw my hair growing in so white, I thought the contrast was going to look ridiculous. In the summertime when I'm outside, my skin darkens quite a bit, and I was like, I'm gonna look like a domino, or something like that. I’m going to look ridiculous. 

But I've had people come up to me and say such positive things like, oh, your hair colour is so pretty. It's so striking, and all of this. And my hair wouldn't be that way. And I, you know, what? It would be, it would be, everybody is different, but trust, Mother Nature, she knows what she's doing, and just embrace it. 

So many people tell us our entire lifetimes, of what we should look like, and how we should everything. I mean, how we should dress and how you should do this, that, and the other thing. You know, how often do we stop to listen to ourselves. And just say, you know what, I like this about myself, and I don't care what other people say. You know, just to appreciate our beauty that each of us possesses. 

We don't ever go outside in Nature and say, oh, look at the colour of that flower it is totally wrong. Or, look at that tree, it's the wrong shade of green. I mean, we're beautiful creations, just like things outside in Nature. And we just need to start looking at ourselves that way, and stop scrutinizing every little thing. Just to be at peace with ourselves and trust.

Helen: Totally agree with you there. I'm curious to know how your Husband feels about it now that it's grown out?

Lori: He definitely likes it. But I think he's getting a little tired of people coming up to me in the street, and having conversations. I'm joking. But, no, he's very good natured about it. But it is something that's very commonplace, people coming up and commenting, and saying, oh my goodness. You know, that looks really nice. And maybe, maybe one day I'll do that. But he does like it. He does. 

It was very awkward for a full three years, you know, to see that ever-growing white colour inching down my head. But he was there with me riding out the storm, and it looked pretty awkward at times.

I would just sometimes braid my hair, pull it back so that the white was showing on the top, and then the brown was showing in the braids. And I just kind of had fun with it. And I didn't try to cover it up or anything. I just kind of, you know, proudly, I just made the decision that I was going to hold my chin up and I was just going to go out and, look different, look a little odd, and so be it. 

It made me discover something different about myself that I could. I'm proud of myself that I did it. It wasn't easy. So much of our identity, how we see ourselves, how we define ourselves, as women, is wrapped up in this silly package that's temporary. And it's so ridiculous to obsess over it to the degree that some of us do. 

But anyway, I'm proud of myself that I made the decision, and that I saw it through. And I'm quite pleased with it. And I like when women come up to me and they talk to me about it. 

I was very amused at the fact that people just felt so comfortable doing that. And then I just welcomed it, you know. And I encouraged women and I said to them, you know, when the time is right, if you want to do it, do it. And if you never decide to do it, then that's fine too. 

You just have to be happy with yourself. That's the most important thing. If you think that this is going to make you happy, then do it. If you start doing it, and you change your mind, then colour it, it doesn't mean that you failed or that it's anything, it's hair. It's just hair.

Helen: And you need to do what feels right for you, basically.

Lori: Absolutely, absolutely. You just have to be comfortable with it. I never thought, like I said earlier, I never thought that I would be able to do it. Or that I would even do it, even consider it. But I'm really happy that I did. 

And once majority of the grey came out, it pleased me because when I looked in the mirror, my father passed away in 2019. And when I looked in the mirror, I see my dad's hair colour, and it made me feel happy. It's like, oh, there you are Dad, I see you every day on my head. But, you know, it just made me feel, it brought a comfort to me. He was right, my Dad was right. It does look fine, you know.

Helen: It's beautiful colour.

Lori: I regret not doing it earlier. I really do. I think of all of those hours, and all of that money. And all of the chemicals that I put on my head, it's ludicrous. I mean, if you think about it, we're putting these crazy mixtures on top of our heads, right? Where our brain is.

I'm not a chemist. I'm not a scientist, but I can only imagine, I wonder how much smarter I would've been if I didn't. No, I'm joking. But I know that that it can't be good for you.

Helen: I'm gonna ask you one last question then. If somebody came to you and said, I'm thinking about going grey, what advice and tips would you have for them?

Lori: I'd say just listen to your heart on it. Don't take pressure from anyone if they tell you to do something, otherwise. If it's something that you want to do, you'll know when the time is right to do it.

And just try it, give it a shot. If you don't like it, you could always colour it, back to whatever colour you want. I encourage women to do it, and to just embrace who they are. Just embrace what Mother Nature has given us because she doesn't make mistakes.

Helen: Thanks so much for joining me. You've been fascinating to chat to. Enjoy the rest of your day.

Lori: Oh, thank you. Thank you so much. I appreciate it.

Helen: Thanks so much for joining me for this week's show. I hope you've enjoyed it as much as I have. I'll be back again next week, but in the meantime, you can follow me on Instagram at happier.grey. Have a great week.