Helen: Hello, and thanks for joining me, Helen Johnson for the Happier Grey Podcast. I'm pro-ageing and love my grey hair, but I know it can be quite intimidating to take the plunge. So, each week I'll be chatting to other women who've chosen to embrace the grey in the hope of inspiring and supporting you, whether you already have silver hair, in the process of going grey, or just considering ditching the dye.

Today I'm joined by Aisha Iqbal, an award-winning filmmaker and seasoned marketing professional who directed White Hair Don't Care. A new era of beauty, a documentary challenging ageism in the beauty industry.

With over 15years experience in advertising, she blends storytelling strategy and social impact to empower women to embrace their natural ageing process. 

Hello, Aisha. How are you?

Aishah: Hello, Helen. I'm doing very well. Thank you so much for having me here.

Helen: It's very strange for us. 'cause obviously you are eight hours behind me, so for me it's late evening and you're in the middle of the day.

Aishah: I'm in California.

Helen: And I'm in the Northeast of England, so a long way away, but sharing a similar journey. 

Aishah: Yes.

Helen: I'm gonna start by asking you what your hair was like when you were a child?

Aishah: That is a lovely question, I love thinking back to that. So culturally, I come from a Pakistani family, Pakistani background, and culturally what they do, especially with young girls, is they shave their head. You know, when they're born, they actually do this with all babies. 

But I remember for girls the reasoning was so that your hair comes out thicker, and thicker hair, luxurious hair, obviously a sign of beauty. And so, when I was a kid and still now my hair texture is very fine. And I remember my Mom gave me the buzz cut.

I remember being very angry with her about it because at that time I think I was in pre-K. And the little girls around me had nice long hair, and here I was a little girl with a frock and a buzz cut. And so, I remember being very angry at my Mom about that. 

When it grew out, I didn't really take care of it. I was a kid that just let it go unruly then, you know. But it was fine texture and it had a medium brown with reddish highlights kind of colour to it. And I just let it be. I would just run around with my hair all over my face, all day long.

Helen: And how long was it?

Aishah: As it was growing out from the buzz cut, because I wouldn't really take care of my hair my Mom, just for hair management's, ease, would keep it like shoulder length. So that it would be easy enough for me to throw it back in a ponytail if I needed it.

Helen: Did you ever diet when you were in your teens? Did you experiment with it?

Aishah: Never, ever. There's a story though, where I grew up in a household filled with women, so obviously my Mom, but I also had three older sisters. And they were always experimenting with one beauty trend or the other. I describe myself as always having had a lazy relationship with beauty, I never wanted to jump into any of the trends.

I remember back when, like, even when all of my friends were highlighting their hair, and testing out different colours, I never wanted to touch my hair colour. But I remember my older sister one day, she said, let me just try. Let me see if I can give you kind of a mahogany highlight. I was like, okay, fine, you know, she's my older sister. Do whatever you want. 

My hair turned out jet black instead. I don't know if she used the wrong colour, but I remember looking at her, and I was pissed. I was like, what did you do to my hair colour? But again, I didn't colour my hair. Even when I started greying in my twenties, I still didn't colour my hair.

Helen: So, have you never coloured it?

Aishah: I didn't, not until my mid-thirties. And I think it was likely because I was going through some type of crisis, like my career, not going in the trajectory that I wanted it to, my love life not being the way I needed it to be for myself at that time. 

So, with all of this happening in my mind, I was thinking, well maybe if I make a change, you know, trying to get things into control. I was like, I'll change my hair colour, I'll dye my hair, a darker colour. I'll cover my greys, because maybe I'll be beautiful then, and then things will start picking up for me. 

So, I actually started dyeing my hair for the first time in my life, in my mid-thirties. As a fix to my problems.

Helen: Why do you think you thought that would work?

Aishah: Well, I think people in general are brought up to believe beauty is power, especially young girls and women are told this, that if you're a beautiful, you can be powerful. 

We also grow up equating beauty to youth, that the more youthful you look, the younger you look, the more beautiful you are. And so, with that messaging, and especially, you know, working in advertising where I saw this day in and day out. Like target, the younger consumers, we have to go after the younger, demographics. They're the most valuable. The younger, the younger, the younger. 

So, I was just like, okay, I'm in my mid-thirties. Already number wise, I am considered an older woman in, you know, modern society. And now I'm an older woman with greying hair. 

Also seeing the signals around me at work. You know who was getting promoted, who was getting valued more? In my mind, I thought that I needed to fit a type of persona, which included physically looking younger.

So, I thought that if I colour my hair, I will look younger, and by that I would be more beautiful. And that if I'm more beautiful, life will fix itself for me. So that is the thought that I had.

Helen: So, do you think part of that was kind of influences from what you see in adverts with the beauty industry as well?

Aishah: 100%. I mean growing up and just watching tv, watching commercials, you know, the messages that we get in the advertisements is very much like, if you're younger, if you're more beautiful, you know, life unfolds itself for you in exactly the way you want to. 

And again, that beauty is power messaging. It's a very powerful message. Especially, in a culture where women's value is higher in the home space versus out in public. So, growing up in the Pakistani household, a woman's role in the home is very important, but she's not necessarily pushed to be very public facing. So again, it's where do we hold the power?

And then if you are to be public facing, you need to be well-manicured, you need to be well-mannered, and there are just so many more rules that women have to follow when they step outside of the house. 

And so with that kind of conditioning, in my head I was just like, okay, well I guess this is what Mom and my sisters were trying to teach me all these years, that I need to be a well-manicured woman, you know, if I'm gonna step out into the public spaces.

So again, me and my very lazy relationship with beauty. I was just bumbling along trying to figure out, you know, how to fix these things in my life. And instead of going inward to see, you know, what are the holes or the gaps that I need to fill inside, I went outward. I'm like, yes, your grey hair is the problem. Go fix that.

Helen: I didn't start dye my hair until I was in my thirties, and I started dyeing mine when I broke up with my first husband. I was dating another guy, who was a few years younger than me, and I met his mother. And I had a little bit of grey in the front of my hair, and she was like, oh my God, how old is she?

And the guy paid for me to have highlights in my hair. I said yes. And I look back now and go, why would I do that? But I think sometimes you're just a bit of a low ebb emotionally, and that makes you much more vulnerable to the messaging that you're receiving from every quarter, really. 

Okay, I'm gonna take you back a little bit. Can you remember when you found the first white hair, how old you were?

Aishah: I think it was in my twenties that I started greying, so I, think maybe 24. That sounds like the right number.

Helen: And how did you feel about it when they started appearing?

Aishah: I honestly didn't feel any way about them. Which was interesting to me, because up until that point, I never saw any woman in my family with grey hair. Because they were all colouring their hair, highlights and everything. So, when I saw my hair, my grey hair starting to come out, I had no feelings about it.

Now, the people around me had plenty of feelings about it. I remember my Mom starting to tell me you need to colour your hair now, because you're too young to have white hair, and you're doing yourself a disservice. 

And then similarly, my younger brother, his messaging was different, but the same saying colour your hair, you're starting your career, you're doing so well in your career, you know, this could be a hindrance. 

Again, I just ignored them. I said, you know, it's not that big of a deal. I don't have a problem with it. I don't want the additional stress of having to constantly worry about colouring my hair, spending that money on it. I'm fine. I'm completely fine.

There's actually a fun story where, I was walking with my younger brother and my niece. We were in the San Francisco Pier. It was one of those times where my brother was advising me that, you know, hey, you should colour your hair, because you're looking unnecessarily older. Right? And you know it's gonna impact your career. Not in a good way. 

As he finished saying that, a woman walks up to us and she says to my brother, she was just like, oh, your daughters are beautiful. And immediately he's like stunned to silence. I'm laughing my butt off. I am just having an amazing time with this. 

The lady looks super confused because she's not sure what just happened, and why my reaction is the way it is. But after she walks away, I then looked to my brother. I'm like, see, my hair's not a problem. She thought I was your daughter. So, I think I'm okay. 

And so that mindset, stayed with me, you know, for more than a decade until my thirties, like my mid-thirties when I had my crisis, and I felt like I needed to make a change.

Helen: Okay. Quick question about your brother then. Did your brother have grey hair at the time?

Aishah: Not yet. The funny thing is my Dad when he was growing up, when he was a young adult, he had aspirations to be part of the United Nations. So, when he came to the US and he finished his master's here, he applied and he joined. And at that time, he was the youngest diplomat.

So, in order to, I guess, show his status, or increase his status. My Mom remembers that he was really looking forward to having his grey hair come out. So much so that in his sideburn, so back in the Seventies when the chops were in, he actually grew them out because that's where his first grey hair popped up. And he wanted to show the world that, look, you know, I have white hair, I am older and I'm wiser. 

So that's always made me laugh that, you know, my father being a man was looking forward to his greys coming out. Whereas for us ladies, and especially the ladies in my family, it was something to hold off for as long as possible.

Helen: What was the catalyst for you deciding to stop dyeing your hair?

Aishah: The year was 2021, the month was March, we were all in the midst of the Pandemic. And now that I had to bring the work home, I was constantly on video calls. And I remember before each video call, I would do a quick root check, to see if my roots were showing. And if they were, I would quickly run to the bathroom, apply some mascara, and then come back. And so, each call was like that. Do a quick root check. Is anything showing if so, do I have to hide it? 

And then in March, 2021, my company at that time was running a campaign for International Women's Day. And what they wanted us to do was to answer the question and record ourselves on video answering this. The question was: What do we choose to challenge on this International Women's Day? 

And I decided that I wanted to challenge ageism, and the way I was going to do that was by not colouring my hair anymore. And I remember that decision was so easy for me to make at that time, because of how annoyed I got at this routine that I had of checking for my roots, and the low-level stress that I would have every single call if I had my roots showing.

I was just like, man, I was not like this before. What happened? So, this is a time where I did go inward, where I did ask myself, why do I continue to do this? And that is when I decided that I wanted to return to the woman that I was in my twenties, who didn't give a crap about her greying hair. 

So, it was really the catalyst was my company asking us to challenge something on this International Women's Day, and in parallel me just getting annoyed by my own habit of letting my roots control my stress levels. So that's when I decided to stop colouring my hair.

Helen: And did you just literally stop colouring it?

Aishah: I did go cold turkey. Because again, I was a lazy dyer. I was a box girl. One box of hair colour would last me, about five to six months, because again, I was only colouring my front part. So that was an easy enough decision. I didn't have a salon routine to kick.

But during that process, I think two or three months in, I did start wondering if there's an easier way to do it. Because that ugly phase that I'm sure you can understand or relate to maybe, was oh my god these roots, they're growing out. I have like two, three inches of like white hair, and the rest is dark hair. I was like, this does not look great. I was like, is there an easier way to do it? 

And at that time, I came across a style called Grey Balayage. I don't know if I'm saying that right. But basically, they would like, you know, colour your hair with different shades of like grey, and white, and black, kind of like letting it blend in. And I was just like, Ooh, I think that would look really cool. And this way I get it all out of the way, and my grey white hair can just grow out naturally with these highlights in it. 

So, I started researching. I went to a couple of salons to get a kind of quote on the procedure and everything like that, and every salon turned me away. Saying that the process would be really long and potentially damaging to my hair, and it would be very costly. So, I had to give up on that idea. And decided that, you know what? Doing it the hard way, cold turkey will have to be what I do.

Helen: So, my next question, is how did your family react to you going grey?

Aishah: What a great question that is. So, my family, it was largely my Mom, who had very strong feelings about this decision of mine. She would constantly say, you know, you look so fresh, you still look so young. Why are you doing this to yourself?

I understand my Mom's perspective. What she really wants is to make sure that I'm okay, that I'm safe, I'm secure. And from her perspective, you know, remaining youthful, remaining beautiful, that is a big way for a woman to be safe, and to be secure in life. And so, I understand why my Mom, you know, felt the way she did about my decision.

And so, for me, I just had to continue to show her that, hey, Mom, I am good. Life is good for me. I am healthy, I'm happy, I'm thriving even with this decision. And so, the more I was able to show that to my Mom, the easier it was for her to come to terms with my decision. 

Funny thing is, when I started the filmmaking journey for my documentary called White Hair Don't Care, I started it by making first a proof of concept. And it was a less than four-minute film that I made. I asked my Mom to take part in it. The topic that this microfilm was addressing was: How the world reacts to a woman after she makes the decision to stop colouring her hair. 

So, I asked my Mom to play the role of my Mom, you know, and to kind of give me feedback on this decision. She was more than happy to take on that part to do the voiceover. And she even said, oh, I won't have to act 'cause I'm just gonna share my real feelings. 

This was 2023 when, I was making this proof of concept, I started laughing at my Mom. I was just like, Mom, I'm glad. Thank you for saying yes. I'm glad that you'll be able to do this naturally. So, I remember when I was filming that and when we were having this conversation for the film, you know, my Mom's role, as my Mom was sharing that, you know, she was unhappy with my decision and whatnot. 

And at that time, I took it very light-heartedly. I wasn't offended by it because by that point I completely understood where my Mom was coming from. And I also knew in my heart that my Mom just wanted to make sure that I was happy, and that I was okay. But it was really fun to get to that point with my Mom, about my decision.

So, it was really interesting my friends. Had a much more, I wanna say, positive reaction. And I think it came in the form of really not commenting on it for a little bit. But the community around me, the friends I have from the community at my daughter's school, I remember so many women would come and compliment me on my hair. And then very quickly they would follow that up with, oh, but I could never do it because of one reason or the other.

So, I would have friends come and compliment me and say, oh, I wish I could do it, but I don't have the right skin tone for it. I don't have the right hair colour for it. I think it's gonna make me look washed out, or it's gonna make me look tired. So, I heard a lot of, reasons for why they themselves could not stop colouring their hair.

A story related to the making of my proof of concept for the White Hair Don't Care documentary. Another scene that I had in that proof of concept was, you know, a group of friends talking to me about this decision, and I'd asked my, friends to come together. I was throwing a pool party for my daughter and her friends. And I said, hey ladies, let's record this voiceover for my film, if you guys don't mind. 

And then, right before we started recording, one of my friends pulled me aside. She was like, hey, I just wanted to let you know, I'm so sorry, but I went to the hair salon this morning, and I got my hair coloured, and I just want you to know that I think you look beautiful with your grey hair. But I just felt like a fraud, that I went and I got my hair coloured, and now I'm going to do this voiceover for your film. And I'm so sorry. 

I just looked at her and I was just like, I don't give a crap what you do with your hair. That is your business, that is your decision. You are doing me a favour by, you know, doing this voiceover for my film. So, thank you. And I was like, please don't apologize for a decision that you've made for yourself, that has no bearing on my decision, or this film that I'm making. 

So, it was really interesting to see how a decision that I've made for myself, and my hair, impacted other people's perspectives on their own decisions, and how they would react to me based on that.

Helen: Where did you get the idea to do the film?

Aishah: Where I got my idea for the film was really a journey. I by no means am a filmmaker. I have never made a film before, so this was very much my first time doing it. And the way I got into it really was a process that built on itself. 

It started with a conversation that I was having with a couple of family members, younger family members during Thanksgiving 2022. I was talking to my two nephews who are entrepreneurs. They were discussing how they wanted to use social media to boost their respective businesses. 

And so, they had crafted this social media challenge. It was a hundred-day challenge, where they said that they would post for a hundred days about their business and their goals, and then see what comes of it.

By then I'd already experimented with creating a personal brand for myself on social media. So, they both looked at me and they said, hey, you should do it with us. And I said, no, you know, this sounds like a great idea for you guys, but I don't have a business, you know, I don't know what I would talk about for a hundred days. I was like, y'all do it. I'm happy to follow your journey. 

When I came back to San Francisco after that visit, my mind just would not shut up. I kept getting ideas for what I could do on social media for a hundred days. And then finally it was almost like a light bulb kind of moment where, you know, I thought, what if I was to talk about my hair experience?

Because as I mentioned, once I stopped colouring my hair, it was actually a positive experience for me, where I had strangers, you know, on the street, young and old men and women complimenting me on my hair. Which led me to ask the question, well, why aren't more women doing this? 

And so, with that question in mind, I decided that I will do this a hundred-day challenge, posting about myself, my hair, my journey, my life, my experience, to see what kind of feedback I would get from people.

My nephew advised that I should do this on TikTok because this is where the younger generation mostly congregates. Which scared the crap out of me, because I wasn't active on TikTok. And I thought to myself that these young people are gonna eat me alive, if I start posting about this. But I got over that fear. And I decided to spend the next a hundred days posting about my hair and whatnot. 

It was such an interesting experience. A few of my posts went viral, so I got to experience that. I experienced trolling comments, you know, dealing with trolls and things like that. But really the biggest insights that I walked away with was that number one: The younger generation is panicking about getting older.

And number two: The younger people, the younger women who actually have a positive outlook on ageing are the ones that saw examples of that around them. So, they had moms, and sisters, and cousins who had stopped colouring their hair, and were actually thriving after having made that decision. 

So, with those two insights I was just like okay, I guess what this means is that we need to put more examples. Of women who are accepting their natural ageing process, women who have stopped colouring their hair. And again, that didn't immediately lead me to making the film. 

I first tried to get it on a stage, I wanted to talk about it. So, I tried out for a TEDx event in Washington DC. I pitched the idea to a live audience. I made runner up, but I didn't get the speaker slot. And so, during the month of depression after that, you know, 'cause I couldn't let go of the idea, I was like, this thing has legs and I need to make it run. But how? 

I have a friend who is a filmmaker, and he had always told me that I should try my hand at it. But I'd always said no, because I'm not a filmmaker. I don't know how to do this. But during that month it came into my head like, why don't I just make a documentary about it? And I said, okay, that sounds interesting. But I don't know anything about this. 

So, I had to really do some soul searching. I really had to build my confidence in this space. And what I mean by that is I had to look at the various skills, and experiences that I've already had, like in my social media work. For a hundred days I was creating, you know, bite-sized stories through video. And I was making videos, I was editing them. So essentially, I had the skills, and the tools. I just needed to go do it.

What really turned me on to the film was one night I was doing some research. I was on YouTube and I was looking at, you know, short documentaries. And I saw a documentary, it was under five minutes, and it left such a strong impression on my heart. And I was thinking, wow, if a five-minute film can have such an impact on me. I can do this.  I've made five-minute videos, four-minute videos on TikTok. I was like, I can do this too. 

So that was really the catalyst that got me to make the proof of concept. The fact that I saw a format, you know, a short film. And so, I got a camera, it took me a month to make more proof of concept.

Then I submitted it to film festivals, without any expectations. But I just figured, I was like, this is a thing to do, I've made a film, let me submit it to film festivals. Again, zero expectations, but a few months into this it had been screened at three film festivals. My little four-minute film was shown on the big screen, and it also won some awards.

And so finally, the award that I won in April of 2024 is what really started this journey that I'm on now. I won the Audience Choice Award for my proof of concept and the festival director had said to me that, hey, keep telling your people to come watch this, because your film is getting highly voted.

And in my mind, I was saying to myself that I haven't told anyone in my community about this film festival. So, the people who are voting for my film are complete strangers. And so, if complete strangers are awarding me with an Audience Choice Award. This means that this film has an audience out in the world, and I need to create a bigger vision.

So that is what got me started to create, what the film is now it's a 24-minute short documentary. And it talks about gendered ageism in the beauty industry. And I speak to various social media influencers who have shared their grey out journey online. 

I've also spoken to female beauty company founders who give their perspective, on what the beauty industry has been, and how they're trying to change it. So, it's been a lovely adventure.

Helen: Where is the film distributed?

Aishah: Currently it is making its way around on the film festival circuit. The next film festival where it'll be screened, it's an online festival, is called the Global Peace Film Festival. And it will be screened September 22nd through the 28th online. And the links are available on my Instagram account, The White Hair Don't Care film Instagram account will have the link, and it's free to screen on those days. 

But I'm also working with an impact agency to get this film into bigger spaces, onto bigger stages, partnering with beauty brands and other organizations, because my intention for this film is not just for everyday women to watch, and get inspiration from. But I also wanted to create some ripples in the beauty and advertising industry, because that's really where we're getting most of our messaging from. That needs to change.

Helen: Agreed. I'm just gonna ask you one more question now, as well as saying good luck with the film, but my last question for you would be, if someone came to you and said, I'm thinking about going grey, what hints and tips would you have for them?

Aishah: I did the cold turkey path, and it was hard, because it was one thing to have made this decision, and another to actually see it come through on a daily basis. There were a lot of days where I would look in the mirror, and question why I did it. Because I didn't like what I saw being reflected back. I had to continually remind myself of my why.

And my why was that I wanted to go back to being that woman who didn't care about the colour of her hair, who was more interested in spending her energy in doing something purposeful. For herself, her family, and her world. And so, I wanted to be very particular about where I put my energy, and my finances in. So, I had to continually remind myself of why I made this decision, and to keep going. 

What was also very helpful was to also think of my future self. Because also during this time, what I found myself doing was looking at old pictures of myself and thinking, oh my God, you know, I was so beautiful then. And then remembering that at that time I didn't think so. 

So, I had to tell myself that when my future self, when my 80-year-old self looks back at my 45, 46, 47-year-old self, she's going to think how amazing I looked. So why not channel that feeling now? Why not allow myself to feel that now, rather than look back at this time, and think why didn't I feel beautiful then? So, it was a lot of inner coaching, inner dialoguing, a lot of pep talking. 

But honestly, what helped very much, and I wish it wasn't the case, was the validation. It was again, like strangers complimenting me. I mean, I did get a couple of comments here and there where, when I went out to dinner with my daughter, the wait staff asked if I was her grandmother. And a random person asking my partner if I was his mother. My partner is also fully salt and pepper, more so than me, so that really cracked me up. 

So even though I had moments like that. My experience has overwhelmingly, been more positive than anything else. So it was really just continuing to remind myself of why I am doing it, and how I will actually feel about it later on down the line.

Helen: Cool. Thanks very much for joining me. It's been fascinating chatting to you, and good luck with getting wider distribution on the film.

Aishah: Helen, thank you so much. This has been such a wonderful conversation, and I'm so honoured that you gave me space here to share my story.

Helen: Thanks so much for joining me for this week's show. I hope you've enjoyed it as much as I have. I'll be back again next week, but in the meantime, you can follow me on Instagram at happier.grey. Have a great week.