Helen: Hello, and thanks for joining me, Helen Johnson for the Happier Grey Podcast. I'm pro-ageing and love my grey hair, but I know it can be quite intimidating to take the plunge. So, each week I'll be chatting to other women who've chosen to embrace the grey in the hope of inspiring and supporting you, whether you already have silver hair, in the process of going grey, or just considering ditching the dye.

Today I'm joined by Rachel Eglinton, a brand photographer who helps business owners show up confidently and authentically, both in person and virtually worldwide. She lives aboard her narrow boat, cruising the connected waterways of England, running her business with a love for freedom, creativity, and meaningful connections.

Hello, Rachel. How are you?

Rachel: Thank you, Helen. That was a great introduction. I'm really to be here and to inspire others to see as powerful and positive.

Helen: That's a great attitude to have to it. I'm gonna stop asking you, can you remember when you found your first grey hair?

Rachel: I can't remember specifically Helen, but I know in my twenties when I had my children, I always had a grey hair, a grey hair, kind of side front, long. It was always frizzy where the rest of my hair at that time was straight. 

My hair, interestingly only curled after children. So now I have wavy hair, which I'd had straight prior to children.

So, this one grey hair is all I can remember through my twenties into my probably mid-thirties. Yeah. I never thought to pull it out. My grandmother had told me when I was a child, if you pull out the grey hair, you'll have seven to replace it. 

So, I kind of just let it sit there. Sometimes it stuck out because it was a bit thick and a bit wiry. But I wasn't bothered about it particularly.

Helen: So, you weren't tempted to dye it, to cover it up?

Rachel: No, I wasn't tempted to dye it, although I did dye my hair it wasn't to cover the white. 

The first time I had my hair dyed, was I was 17, and I had gone on a narrow boat holiday with my school. And I guess there were probably two teachers and maybe 12 of us, 17-year-olds. And randomly a girl had some dye in her bag on holiday.

And so, one summer's day we all sat on the roof of the narrow boat, and I can remember Dire Straits was booming from inside, and she just dyed my hair. I didn't have any grey. I was 17. But that was my first experience of having my hair dyed. 

And then in my twenties I decided, under the guidance of my hairdresser, I would maybe have it a little bit lighter in the summer, a little bit darker in the winter.

And what I noticed was whenever I had my hair dyed, the texture was much improved. My hair is prone to be frizzy and dry. And actually, when I had it dyed, it was softer, I would say. So, I continued having it dyed from twenties up till I was 45.

Helen: What colour was your hair when you were a child?

Rachel: Light brown. So sometimes I would go lighter. It's dark brown now, I've got dark brown eyes as well. So, it was light brown and it was straight, and it stayed straight until I had my children. But it got darker as I grew. 

And in fact, my eldest daughter, she was blonde when she was born, and now she's late twenties, and she is dark blonde. Not as dark as me, but much darker, certainly than when she was young, so yeah.

Helen: I was probably like her then. I had white blonde hair until I was about 10, and then it, gradually got darker and darker all through my twenties.

Rachel: Yeah.

Helen: And then the white streak appeared. 

Rachel: My Dad I think was the same. He was born blonde, very blonde, and then it got darker as he grew. So, I guess it's just the genes in our family, but I wasn't that blonde, but certainly lighter.

Helen: And you stopped dyeing your hair in your forties, you said. 

Rachel: Yeah.

Helen: What was the catalyst for that?

Rachel: I had more grey coming through, and when I went to the stylist, she suggested that I should let it grow through naturally. So, at that time I was living and teaching in Romania. 

And I had a lovely hairdresser who was like me, very natural, loose hair long. And she said to me, if you want to stop having it dyed, I'd had it a couple of times with her, but I wasn't really wanting to do that because I'm natural. 

And she said to me, if you want to grow your grey out, the best thing to do is to have a really sharp cut. So, in April of 2019, I had a very short, sharp cut. So, a short Bob. My hair was wavy. I had it cut in a Bob, and she put some highlights through. Those highlights made my hair more frizzy. 

So, I went back, and I said to her, I've got the cut. The idea is I'm supposed to be growing the grey through. But you are covering it with highlights. It doesn't feel good. So, she, took the highlights out. She did an all over colour, and she said, right, we'll just leave it like that. We'll do nothing. 

So, from April, 2019, I was in Romania, we had an early shutdown for COVID. We were locked down then for quite some time, and it was in October of 2020. So, all of that time I hadn't had my hair cut, and the grey had grown down. 

The colour that she'd put in temporarily to hide these highlights that had made my hair frizzy, had gone. And my hair had grown down to about shoulder length, and it was I'll say salt and pepper. It was more grey on the top than underneath, so when I pinned it up you wouldn't know that it was grey from the back. Whereas when it's down you would. 

So, I guess unlike lots of your other guests who went grey during COVID, I kind of started ahead of it. So, when COVID ended, I was long again. And salt and pepper. Yeah.

Helen: So, did she put a semi-permanent colour on it? The solid colour?

Rachel: I think it was semi-permanent or even temporary Helen. I dunno how, not really into the colouring. But I think maybe it was even just a few weeks, because what I had noticed in my twenties was when the colour went on, my hair was a lot softer. 

When she did the highlights, it felt like straw. So I went back, and I think maybe it was even just a temporary colour, just to get the feel. I want my hair to feel natural. And so, she puts it on, I don't know, semi-permanent, temporary, just to feel natural. 

I don't like any products in my hair. I didn't like the feeling of straw. But when that came out, my hair felt okay, and then I just grew it through.

Helen: So, you didn't have a solid line then?

Rachel: No. I had quite a lot of grey at the front, when I first decided to go grey. And when she cut it into a short Bob, because she said to me, when you're going grey, you want people to notice something else about your hair, because then they won't notice the fact that you're going grey.

And I thought that was really good advice. So, from being long, she cut it into a Bob above my chin. And actually, I quite liked it then. And that happened just to be the last cut. 

I think she was right. I didn't have the line. I had the light bits at the front. I had the short cut. And then more bits just came through after the colour, and it was the back. And I didn't really fuss. I think her advice was right, and I liked the way that I did it.

Had it not been COVID and I was still going out, I would've been quite happy to go out. And I don't think people would've thought, oh, Rachel's going grey. I think it just would've been streaks of grey, and it probably would've looked okay, yeah. I wasn't, self-conscious about it at all.

Helen: Oh, which makes you quite unusual. 'cause most people I've spoken to were. I think 'cause they were so paranoid about their roots beforehand. 'cause we're sort of so educated that you shouldn't have roots. They're a bad thing. You need to cover them as soon as possible.

Rachel: Yeah, so I think my roots were coming through, and in the highlights, she hadn't picked up the lightness at the front, the greying at the front. So that was of course the main bit that I could see, and I was happy that it just grew. 

So, when she cut it short, that was how long my longest grey hairs were. Then they just grew down as the hair grew down as the hair grew down. And, as well, more grey hair came.

Helen: Have you had any reaction from your friends and family to going grey?

Rachel: Not adverse reactions, but I have had people saying, oh Rachel, I like your hair. And it's kind of like that, really. I dunno what they're thinking quite. I've always just worn my hair loose, and I just think maybe people just don't really know if I'm gonna have long hair, or short hair, or medium length hair.

So, it's kind of like they may have just commented on the cut, rather than the fact that I'm grey and brown now. I haven't had any adverse comments. I've still got friends who dye their hair, who underneath its grey and frizzy. Yeah. Each to his own, I guess.

Helen: Do what you feel comfortable with.

Rachel: Yeah. And for me, I prefer being natural, and I've lent into that more as I've aged. So, looking back, probably colouring it through my twenties, thirties wasn't the best thing. So now I wouldn't want to colour it. Yeah, just happy to be leaning into what it is really.

Helen: And I'm guessing you don't have a sort of a high maintenance regime for looking after it. What do you to keep it in good condition?

Rachel: Yeah, you are absolutely right. So, my relaxed, natural nature, combined with living on a narrow boat make it very difficult for me to be preened and pruned.

So basically, I wash my hair weekly. I use natural products because I've got to be aware of what I'm putting directly into the water. So, plant-based shampoo, plant-based conditioner, so long as it's moisturizing or nourishing, those kind of words on the label, I'm happy. 

And then I don't like a product on my hair. I don't like a stiff mousse. And even recently I went to the salon and I said, I don't like it stiff. And I came out with it all scrunched and stiff. I had to just wash it, 'cause it just didn't feel like me. 

So, all I do is I use oil afterwards, and just put the oil through. I don't brush it daily, I just let it be until the next wash. And then I comb it with a conditioner. So, it's very natural. It's very relaxed.

Helen: Two questions then. So, what kind of oil?

Rachel: Moroccan oil.

Helen: Okay. And guessing you don't dry it?

Rachel: No. So, I only have 12-volt electricity on my boat, so I couldn't have a hairdryer on my boat from the electricity point of view, because I'm cruising all the time. If I was in a marina I could, but I don't have a dryer.

I don't have straighteners. I did straighten it, through my thirties, but I don't have straighteners anymore. I just wash it, towel dry, and let the wind blow it.

Helen: Which is probably easier in the summer than the winter.

Rachel: Yeah. It's fine. I don't actually mind wet hair. For me the greatest feeling, Helen, is for it to feel natural.

Helen: Yeah. I like mine natural, and its similar sort of length to yours.

Rachel: Yeah.

Helen: Also gets washed once a week, so.

Rachel: Yeah, sometimes when it's been raining or something like that, I'll wash it more often. When I've been wearing a hat and it's very flat, I will pin it up. But really, yes, you're right I'm low maintenance.

Helen: There's nothing wrong with that. So, the next question I'm gonna ask you something a little bit different. How do you feel about where you're at in the ageing process?

Rachel: Oh, that's an exciting question. I'm happy where I am. I've always been of that attitude. it feels right where I am. I left 30 years of teaching a few years ago, just to follow my dreams, I say. So, I moved aboard my narrowboat. That's when I started cruising continuously. Set up my own business. 

And I just felt like that was the right time. Now is the time for me to have my own business. And other times in my life I've made transitions like that. So when I was mid-forties I was made redundant, and rather than just get another job in the area, I decided to go abroad, and have some different opportunities in a multicultural school.

So, I feel like I'm in the right place at the right time, and if now I'm mid-fifties, that feels okay to me. I have to be aware, I suppose, of ageing well. So, you know, thinking about things like movement, cooking from scratch, using healthy ingredients, that kind of like incorporating those things in my lifestyle. But I've always done that, so it hasn't really changed. 

I just feel good where I'm at now, it feels like the right place to be.

Helen: Which is cool. I think, it's good to be at peace with where you're at in the ageing process, because let's face it, there's nothing that you can do about it. It is where you're at.

Rachel: Yeah, there's no point fighting it.

Helen: So, I quite often I ask people about whether the colours they wear have changed as they've aged. I'm guessing your options are a little bit limited on a narrow boat anyway.

Rachel: For many years now, probably a decade or more, I've been really interested in following, a lady online. Can I say?

Helen: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Rachel: I've been interested in following a lady online who's called Sylvia, whose business is 40 plus style. And so, she focuses on, empowering women who are 40 plus, in their style, which includes their hair, their makeup, the colours that they wear, et cetera.

And so, I wore a lot of orange before I went grey. And one thing I learned from Sylvia was when you go grey, your skin may go paler and some colours that suited you well before that won't suit you so much now. 

And I really read, I'd say probably a year or so before I decided to go grey, I really read, and thought about what changes I was going to make in my wardrobe. And started taking out orange scarves. I had a lovely linen orange dress, I let it go. And then, bringing in some paler colours, and so yeah, my wardrobe has been a transition on account of this.

And then, last year when I was living aboard my boat, I was having to get rid of my pencil skirts and my heels from being a teacher. Finally thinking, this is not me, I'm not going back to the classroom. 

And so, did a couple of colour analysis, and at that time had my salt and pepper hair. And so, both of those came back, I got two views, but they were the same, but just to confer. When they came back it was confirmed that what I had learned years previous, that pale colours suited me better, so softer, muted colours.

And in fact, I got a cashmere half zip jumper in pale blue. And family and friends have said to me, oh, that's such a lovely colour. You look so good in that colour. I would never have worn pale blue before. So, I'm really in leaning into sort of like the lilacs, the pale blues, the pale greens. Yeah, it's made a difference to me.

Helen: That sounds like you're a summer person then?

Rachel: Yeah, I think so. I think I am a summer. I had always thought I was an Autumn Helen, and so I couldn't get how going Grey had made me summer. But one of the ladies who did the analysis said to me, when you've got salt and pepper hair, you are cool. That's it. 

Her way of doing it was a tonal way, not seasons. And she said, if it's salt and pepper, you've got to be cool. Well, you're clearly not winter, so you've got to be soft summer.  

I got 30 colours from each lady, and basically, I could blend them and see how similar they were, and just build up my wardrobe from there. So, kind of, I've just started with scarves. I started with scarves and then kind of just jumpers, tops really. Yeah.

Helen: I had mine done many, many years ago, by two different people. 'Cause I was working for a knitting company at the time, and we were considering doing ranges for each of the seasons. And we wanted to be sure how consistent they were between different brands. I was summer with both of them, and I think I'm still summer.

Rachel: Yes. I dunno how I transitioned from, I had two many years ago when I was in my twenties, and both of those said I was autumn. And I loved wearing autumnal colours. 

I think the similarity is now I'm soft summer with muted colours. There can be in the autumn palette, muted colours still, but it's just which colours are better near the face. 

I find it really interesting, and I'm happy to sort of like go with their suggestions. And then when you get the comments it kind of confirms that their suggestions are correct. It's nice to kind of be supported with what colours and styling you want to have, but also to be in control of it, you know? 

And with going grey, I wanted to be very led by, the grey and by myself, not by somebody saying about what colours to wear. I wanted to kind of do it myself really, but just have the guidance of somebody more experienced who knew. So yeah.

Helen: yeah, I had a similar thing to you in that, going grey pretty much coincided with leaving the corporate world. I always wore dresses, and normally leather jackets rather than smart jackets. But now I have no call for them in my life.

Rachel: Yeah, I’ve really thought a lot since moving onto the narrow boat. Been here a couple of years now, but I've really thought about my identity. Who am I? I'm not a mum because my children are grown up. I'm not a teacher. Who am I? You know, that identity, it's been an exciting transition.

Helen: I'm kind of going through that. So, I have one daughter, I dropped her at university, not last weekend, the weekend before.

Rachel: Oh.

Helen: So the house is very empty.

Rachel: I went to Romania. At the time when I was made redundant, my youngest daughter was going off to uni. She was planning where she was going, and so as I was made redundant at the end of that school year when she went to uni, I just left. So, I haven't witnessed the empty nest.

Helen: Oh, the biggest change for me at the moment is the cat, just wants to be with me constantly, and wants to sit on me constantly. One of his people's gone, so the other one's going nowhere, so he has to sit on me every time. 

Rachel: You’re being two people now for the cat.

Helen: Yeah. I'm gonna ask you one last question then. So, if somebody came to you and said, I'm thinking about going grey. What tips and advice would you have for them?

Rachel: Well, the first thing I would say is embrace it. If you are thinking of going grey, because you've got bits of grey in it, leave the dyeing, free up the burden of having to go to the stylist, and just the constant upkeep, and just be yourself. Just immerse in it and do it. 

And then if you feel a little bit uncomfortable, I think headbands, hats, scarves. You can be creative. You can cover up if you have a line. I never had a line, so I didn't need to, but I've often thought if I did, I would wear something on my hair in a creative way, so it went with my style. Just to feel a little bit more comfortable. 

And then, I guess the third thing I would say is, what my stylist did, go for a cut. Change the cut, because people will notice the cut, rather than the fact that you are greying.

Helen: I have had someone else say that to me.

Rachel: And from my experience, it definitely worked.

Helen: I think it depends on how comfortable you feel with your hair being at different lengths. 'cause I know some people go for a Pixie Cut, and I was never gonna do that. But I did end up at one point with a jaw length layered Bob, just to try and get rid of the colour.

Rachel: Yeah, yes. I wouldn't go for a Pixie Cut either, Helen. I like my hair long, but I was happy to go for that short Bob. In order for the grey to go through and not to be too ratty, tatty, and yeah.

Helen: Cool. Well, I'm gonna say thanks very much for joining me then. I've really enjoyed chatting to you. Enjoy the rest of your day.

Rachel: And I'll say thank you, Helen. I've loved chatting to you, and I hope our talk encourages other women to lean into their natural self.

Helen: Thanks so much for joining me for this week's show. I hope you've enjoyed it as much as I have. I'll be back again next week, but in the meantime, you can follow me on Instagram at happier.grey. Have a great week.